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Should the IDW Transformers Character Pages be reorganized? Print Comic
The The Transformers (IDW) entry is one of the longest running comic entries in the franchise, and many of the titles under it have been given pages. Several of those works have also been given character pages, and those pages have been given sub-pages. Most of the main ones have been documented on the "Hasbro Comic Universe" character page, but their sub-pages haven't. The Transformers: More than Meets the Eye for instance has 11 subpages, while The Transformers: Robots in Disguise has 2 subpages. What's more though is that several pages are filled with either duplicate entries that are either identical to each other, or list a redirect but also list tropes for that specific work.
- The Transformers More Than Meets The Eye Other Characters for example lists Starscream, Rattrap, Overlord, and Soundwave as redirects.
- Or how half the characters on The Transformers: Till All Are One are already listed on The Transformers: Robots in Disguise, despite literally being the same iterations of the character.
Hasbro IDW Universe:
- The Transformers
- Autobots
- Luna 1
- The Wreckers
- Decepticons
- Decepticon Justice Division
- Cybertron / Colonies
- The Lost Light
- Team Rodimus
- Autobots
- Earth (Would include other properties without pages like the Micronauts and M.A.S.K.)
- Action Man
- G.I. Joe
- Gem and the Holograms
- Others
Edited by RebelFalcon
Does this qualify as a stub? (Fall of X) Print Comic
ComicBook.Fall Of X has just been created. It's covering a set of linked works (for Marvel's X-Men comics) which comprise a larger Bat Family Crossover or Crisis Crossover arc.
It's listing the different works and has an intro that talks about the arc as a whole.
It's currently got just two tropes.
So... is it a stub? Or is it exempt from that rule because it's a list of related works as well as a thing in its own right?
Edit War - ComicBook.RedGoblin Print Comic
Possibly confusion on both sides for this one, but it's turned into an edit war.
- Nonentity Z added a second bullet to Mythology Gag on 16th July.
- I deleted it today, partly because I didn't fully understand the point they were trying to make
- NonentityZ added it back today, with an edit reason saying it was a valid example.
There may be a question to be answered about whether a reference to a Marvel Alternate Universe is really a Continuity Nod or a Mythology Gag (when it's acknowledged as part of continuity and characters can travel to/from it for Bat Family Crossovers, I personally think it's a Continuity Nod), but that shouldn't be an edit reason argument.
Edit: link fix
Edited by Mrph1Adding tropes to a page for an earlier installment (X-Cellent) Print Comic
Bringing this one back to ATT as we've failed to reach an immediate consensus on forums - and we now have a disagreement on how to proceed until we do have a consensus.
Marvel's 2022 comic book miniseries X-Cellent was followed by / relaunched as 2023's miniseries The X-Cellent (Recycled Titles, especially character/team titles, are pretty standard for Marvel). That second series is still an ongoing work.
Over the last year or two the prevailing approach has been to create a new page (or, at the very least, a soft split) for comic relaunches of this nature, but StrixObscuro made the point that it may be close enough to the original to be handled as a single work, adding that "I see no reason why we should humor Marvel's cynical relaunches" note The 2023 series has the same creators and directly continues the same arc, and Marvel have directly referred to it as both a Sequel Series and "Season Two". It is treated as a different series on their own indexes (e.g. marvel.com and digital comic apps) and doesn't continue the first series' numbering.
As there was no consensus for an immediate merge, the agreement by default became to wait and see how this progresses, then revisit it when the work's complete, or at least less incomplete - e.g. is it going to get a third installment and how will it be handled for collected editions? We can then make a more informed decision to merge or not.
However, we still seem to have a difference of opinion on how we act in the interim - StrixObscuro has added examples for characters and events from the 2023 sequel to the 2022 series's page.
I moved them over to the 2023 page, not realising this had been a deliberate choice, on the basis that until/unless we merge, tropers wouldn't expect to hit spoilers (tagged or otherwise) or plot details for the new series on the previous installment's works page.
StrixObscuro then challenged that, saying that their view is that we should continue to update it with tropes from both series "until consensus finally and definitively decides that the two pages should remain split".
Can we get a steer on this aspect? I think we've dropped into entrenched positions on this one (and the Marvel cleanup thread's been pretty quiet), so I don't think we're going to resolve it ourselves.
For context, the original ATT is here, and the original cleanup thread discussion starts here.
Edited by Mrph1Death's Head: seeking consensus to revert changes after fact check Print Comic
Two Marvel Comics pages, ComicBook.Deaths Head and Trivia.Deaths Head, have some 'detective work' statements/examples added by DaPolicia regarding the character's creation and copyright status. The same claims were added to The Other Wiki's page for the character.
These are largely updates to examples and text I previously edited or added, so I don't want to revert them myself (and start an edit war) without a consensus.
This is the core claim they've added:
- Pop Culture Urban Legends: Multiple sources, including Simon Furman himself, allege that Marvel maintained Death's Head's rights by rushing out a one-page comic (commonly referred to as "High Noon Tex" after a line spoken by Death's Head in the strip) that was featured in various other Marvel UK comics before his Transformers debut, circumventing the company's agreement with Hasbro. However, artist Bryan Hitch's signature in the final panel reads "Hitch '88", indicating that it wasn't drawn until the year after Death's Head debuted in Transformers, and there's no actual indication that the strip was published until May of 1988, meaning that Marvel likely engaged in some other chicanery to keep Hasbro away from Death's Head.
The collected edition introduction directly states that "High Noon Tex" was created to secure copyright. There's a photo of the relevant statements here◊ for anyone who want to read it.
IANAL, but as I understand it UK copyright law is based on evidence of creation, not just widespread publication. Ashcan Copy logic allows the creation of a quick, sketchy version of the work or character to confirm ownership. The intro says it was "subsequently" published and I don't think a 1988 signature on the final/published work is a "Gotcha!" to show the creators are lying.
With that in mind I'd like to:
- Cut Pop Culture Urban Legends entirely
- Cut the "if Marvel hadn't done whatever they did" element from What Could Have Been, which also casts doubt on Marvel's claims.
- Cut the whole "A commonly-circulated story, corroborated by both Furman and artist Bryan Hitch and perpetuated by sources like This Very Wiki" section that was added to the ComicBook.Deaths Head intro, which casts doubt on the intro's original brief factual statement about the character's creation.
Even if there's more to the story than the official sources suggest, and Marvel isn't telling the complete and accurate history, I don't think it's our place to speculate in this way.
(If we get an official on-the-record statement from the company or creators that contradicts the original printed statements, that would be different)
Does that sound fair?
Edited by Mrph1Possible edit war - Trivia/TheAmazingSpiderMan2022 Print Comic
Does this count as an edit war? Over on The Amazing Spider-Man (2022) - note that links contain spoilers.
This was the example before the recent leaks:
- Why Fandom Can't Have Nice Things: Zeb Wells has said that he'll be avoiding conventions due to the controversy expected to result from some the last issues of the run.
After the first of the recent Content Leaks was confirmed as genuine by Marvel, KingClark added an update to say that this must be because of a particular character death revealed by the leak.
(No source cited for that, and it's since been suggested that this isn't the end of the run, with Wells talking about his next year on the book)
I rephrased it a little with the edit reason "Still scope for more twists, and it hasn't happened yet" - as of today, the issue the leaks are from is still unpublished.
KingClark has now largely reverted that edit, returning it to a definite statement that it's because of the issue and this death.
Does that count as an edit war?
I'd like to revert it again, at least until the issue is published and/or we have a clear statement from Wells about what he meant by the original comment - but that would definitely be an edit war if done without consensus, so I'm holding fire.
Edited by Mrph1No spoilers on a recap page... Print Comic
The rule that no part of a recap should be spoilered isn't valid just for episodes of a TV series, right?
Full albums of a comic-book series having their own recap pages are concerned too, I guess...
I'm asking because I noted that Asterix and the Griffin has lot of spoilered text.
Edited by StFanAvoiding potential edit war - AssPull/ShockingSwerve example (Spider-Man 2022) Print Comic
Checking here before making any further edits, as I don't want to start an edit war:
As part of the wider cleanup on YMMV.Spider Man 2022 (complaining, Content Leak etc.), I cut two Ass Pull examples after seeking a second opinion about one on the AssPull cleanup thread. The thread's pretty quiet and there wasn't enough feedback there for a real consensus, but it seemed to confirm my doubts about the example.
I left an edit reason suggesting that if tropers did want to add the same examples back,"Please check with the cleanup thread before reinstating".
KaneChin89 (who's been active for years but only has a single page edit history for that time) has now added one of the examples back (with an exact copy/paste of the old wording) under Shocking Swerve, which is just a redirect to Ass Pull. There's no edit reason and no cleanup thread post.
(The example was originally added by PhyrexianAjani95, then heavily rewritten by nsommer659 - KaneChin89 hasn't edited it before)
Am I ok to delete it again? (I'll also link to this ATT on the cleanup thread, but - as before - not sure it'll get enough replies for a consensus there).
For context, this is the example:
- Shocking Swerve: The Reveal in #25 that Paul and MJ's kids are adoptive and just so happen to look like them. People immediately speculated that this was Marvel's attempt at an Author's Saving Throw because of the sheer amount of negative reception the plotline has been getting. The hint that her feelings for Paul are artificial as the result of a curse by Rabin also comes across as less something preplanned and more the writers trying to please the fans after all hate hoisted on the storyline.
Content leak issue - Spider-Man Print Comic
As mentioned here, here and here, we've had some issues with today's Spider-Man content leak, revealing a "shocking twist" in a comic to be released later this month. As the comic is due to be followed by a special Fallen Friend (final title embargoed) issue, the assumption was that it involved a major character death.
As per mod guidance from Synchronicity, I added a comment to some of the relevant pages warning tropers not to add leaked content.
Later today, hours after the initial leaked pictures made it onto the internet, Entertainment Weekly published it as an 'exclusive' scoop with clearer images. They also revealed the cover and final title of the Fallen Friend one-shot.
At this point there is no such announcement on marvel.com and it's unclear how 'official' that EW exclusive is, as Marvel had previously said all details were embargoed until end of month. There are certainly no Marvel quotes/comments within the EW article, and there's nothing about it on Marvel's own site yet.
However, Magi Mecha has now:
- Deleted the content leak comment from YMMV.The Amazing Spider Man 2022 and troped it there (spoiler tagging used), edit reason "Cat's out of the bag"
- Deleted the content leak comment from ComicBook.The Amazing Spider Man 2022, edit reason "Cat's out of the bag"
- Deleted the content leak comment from Trivia.The Amazing Spider Man 2022 and updated the Content Leak example to add details and a link, saying " Ultimately, Marvel, via Entertainment Weekly, revealed the shocking death to be [spoiler tagged name]". Edit reason is the EW link, with the character death confirmed in the URL.
- Edited the character's own Characters page (spoiler:Marvel Comics: Kamala Khan) to add the full title of the Fallen Friend special comic, spoiler tagged in a "Notable Comics" list above the line (which I think is in breach of spoiler policy?).
Where do we stand on this? It was clearly an unwanted/unofficial leak earlier today (with Marvel warning fans to avoid spoilers just a couple of hours ago), and although EW's scoop looked a lot more professional, there was nothing to directly say it was with the creator's permission.
Do we accept that the cat really is out of the bag, and let some of these edits stand? (I'm assuming the spoiler tagged title on the Characters page needs to go, either way)
UPDATE: Marvel themselves have finally given in and announced it, with an article on their site. Spoilers, of course. So it looks like the EW story was with their backing.
I guess some of the same questions remain, though - and some of the usual Creating a Work Page for an Upcoming Work considerations will apply to how we cover an unreleased instalment?
Edited by Mrph1Image in Trivia page Print Comic
Trivia.Wonder Woman 1942 has an image on it, which no other Trivia page has. I'm pretty sure that Trivia pages aren't allowed to have images at all. Is it okay to remove it?
Indigogo Links Print Comic
I am doing pages for several works but it's available through Indigogo. Am I allowed to post Indigogo links?
Edited by SynchronicityX-Cellent Print Comic
I discovered that we have two different pages for Marvel's X-Cellent series - X-Cellent and The X-Cellent (2023). Is it really necessary to have two different work pages, considering that one is just a continuation of the other?
Possible edit war - Characters/XMenSinister Print Comic
Earlier today Halogen added a Scam Religion example to the X-Men: Sinister page.
I amended it to add some spoiler tagging, as an event mentioned in the example is after the shared universe spoiler cut-off point listed for the page.
Halogen has now changed it back, deleting the spoiler tagging again, with no discussion or edit reason.
I don't know if that's because they don't view it as a spoiler, but I don't want to unilaterally change it back. Am I ok to revert it?
Edited by Mrph1Moving appearances in various media section on Carnage pages? Print Comic
I was thinking of moving the "Carnage's appearances in various media:" section from the Marvel Comics: Carnage page to Carnage to make it closer to the Venom page.
Thoughts?
Superman = Almighty Janitor? Print Comic
We all know how powerful Superman is, but can he really be considered an Almighty Janitor? An Almighty Janitor is a character who nominally holds a low rank in his official job, but he is actually more powerful and influential than he initially appears.
In both the comics and the DC Animated Universe (which doesn't deviate that much from the main comics), Clark is a front-page columnist at a newspaper as famous as the New York Times and can afford a family apartment in downtown Metropolis, which means he probably earns a six-figure paycheck. Also, in Superman (2023), his wife becomes acting Editor-in-Chief after Perry White suffered a seizure.
So, what do you think?
Edited by MasterHeroCharacter page - alphabetical order? Print Comic
Just looking at X-Men: 2000s Members - it's a single list, it's not sorted by name, and (although it does cover a specific era) it's not sorted by date.
It doesn't seem to be 'core cast first' either.
This is a fairly common scenario for comic character pages for teams and rogues' galleries.
Is there some best practice guidance on how pages like this should be arranged?
(Will also flag this on the discussion page, but it's not specific to that one page - just using it as a case study)
Thanks!
Adding a Deconstructed Character Archetype page for Sonic the Hedgehog IDW Print Comic
So, I was wondering: would it be okay to add in a Deconstructed Character Archetype page for Sonic the Hedgehog (IDW)? It feels like the Deconstructed Character Archetypes with this series is growing each time a new character is introduced into the series and it seems like the many deconstructions done with this series is growing with each issue.
Transformers English/Japanese Names? Print Comic
I just saw the Mazinger Z Versus Transformers page and was confused when I saw that it used the Japanese names for the Transformers characters. I get that those were the names used in the manga's original Japanese, but is there a precedent about whether this page should use the English or Japanese names for the characters?
(Also, since this is a manga that didn't get adapted into an anime, I've put this in the "Print Comic" category. Let me know if that's correct or not.)
How to format numbered bullets to not start over under a new header? Print Comic
Example: I have Sandbox.Bo Boi Boy Galaxy Season 2 in the (gradual) works, I'm considering listing the issues/episodes under either arcs or volumes, as listed at the bottom of the sandbox.
The issue is that when I place a header between two episode titles, the bullet numbers start over, when I'd like for them to still list from 1 to 27.
Is there a formatting trick to make this possible?
Edited by BlackFaithStar